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An 'Interview' With Smedley Butler

CplBobGomez — Fri, 09 May 2008 08:06:04 GMT

An 'Interview' With Smedley Butler

by Don Bacon
by Don Bacon

Major General Smedley Darlington Butler, one of the most colorful officers in the Marine Corps, was one of two Marines to receive two Congressional Medals of Honor for separate acts of outstanding heroism. General Butler was born in 1881 and raised as a Quaker. He was still in his teens when he was commissioned as a second lieutenant for the war with Spain and served in the Philippines, China, Puerto Rico, Panama, Nicaragua, Mexico, Haiti, France, and, after a stint as Director of Public Safety in Philadelphia, in China again. General Butler died at the Naval Hospital in Philadelphia on 21 June 1940. At the time of his death he was the most decorated marine in U.S. history. General Butler has had a naval destroyer, a military base and a chapter of Veterans for Peace (the 'Smed Butts') named for him. He is loved and quoted not only in the United States but around the world. We are fortunate to have General Butler with us for this "interview" conducted by Don Bacon, who founded the Smedley Butler Society several years ago to perpetuate the memory of this masterful maverick Marine.

General Butler is no longer with us in body but his spirit and his popularity live on. He left us a legacy in deeds and words which we have used to construct this imaginary interview that includes his verbatim words and paraphrased quotations. Much of what follows comes from General Butler's book War Is a Racket.

Q: General Butler, the United States military is currently bogged down in Iraq. What are your thoughts?

General Butler: When our forefathers planned this government, they saw no necessity for foreign wars, for wars that didn't concern us. As a matter of fact, after we got our independence our army and navy were eliminated. The Constitution states that the Congress has the power to provide for the common defense, and has the power to raise and support armies, but it also states that such forces can't be funded for more than two years. It says nothing about foreign wars. We had a militia, that is each state had a militia, but this was the only armed force at the time and was not to be used beyond the territorial limits of the United States. If you look into history, you will find that during the War of 1812 a certain regiment of militia marched northward toward Canada, but they refused to cross the border and went home. The militia was for home defense only. That's what our armed forces should be. Home defenders, ready and able to defend our homes, to defend us against attack, and that's all.

Q: What do you think of the recent militarization of US foreign policy, with all this emphasis on force. And do you think it's fun to shoot people as Marine Corps General Mattis once said?

General Butler: Well, I served in the Marine Corps for thirty-three years, and of course my military philosophy evolved. As a seventeen-year-old second lieutenant in the Boxer rebellion, and then as a field grade officer in Central America and Haiti, I conducted myself with a certain flair. Later, as a brigadier general commanding troops in China again, I had a different, and I think more successful, way of dealing with the differences of opinion that normally occur in the course of human events. We had some interests in China at the time, and some Americans were just hoopin' and hollerin' for military action. I, however, felt that they all had personal axes to grind. They were just trouble makers and not problem solvers. If you took them seriously and tried to listen to everything that they said, you'd be hopelessly mixed up. I felt that the local people should settle, among themselves, their own form of government and their own ruler. Our job was to make sure they didn't molest our people, that's all. As long as I was commander, we weren't going to do what we did in the Banana Wars. We weren't going to cause a lot of violence and take over their banks and run things the way we did in Central America, which I unfortunately had a hand in. I felt that the millions of dollars in American capital in China was nothing compared to the taxes Americans would have to pay for the battleships and Marines to protect them. At the time, we were known as "the Marines who wouldn't fight" which was fine with me. My views haven't changed.

Q: What do you think of the current political situation in Washington, with warmongers in control of the government and their talk of continuous war?

General Butler: Back in my day we had similar people. In Italy there was Benito Mussolini, who said: "Fascism . . . believes neither in the possibility or the utility of perpetual peace . . . War alone brings up to its highest tension all human energy." I didn't like this fascist, or any fascist, but the US media loved him. As you may know, I was put under arrest and threatened with court-martial for criticizing Mussolini at the time. Later on, I stopped the bankers' putsch against Roosevelt. See, some Wall Street big shots wanted to topple President Roosevelt and the New Deal. I was a life-long Republican, and they knew that I was a soldier's general, so they approached me and wanted me to lead an army of five hundred thousand veterans to overthrow the government. We'd do the whole thing from Civilian Conservation Corps camps, which were already set up. If I refused, they were going to get MacArthur. Well, I blew the whistle on them. I always sided with the underdog against the rich and powerful with their damnable wars, and I'd do it again.

I spent 33 years and 4 months in active service as a member of our country's most agile military force the Marine Corps. I served in all commissioned ranks from second lieutenant to Major General. And during that period I spent most of my time being a high-class muscle man for big business, for Wall Street and for the bankers. In short, I was a racketeer for capitalism. I suspected I was part of a racket all the time. Now I am sure of it. Like all members of the military profession I never had an original thought until I left the service.

Q: Getting back to the Iraq war, many reports say that the troops are being treated poorly, that they have their service extended, that their equipment and medical care are substandard and that their lack of financial support is punitive and insulting. We don't hear of a soldier's general these days; how did you operate differently?

General Butler: If you take care of the troops, they'll take care of you. Some military people are just careerists, and you can't expect civilians who never served to understand soldiers. In 1917, when I commanded the training base at Quantico, I opposed elevating the Corps Commandant to lieutenant general so long as the soldiers were getting no extra reward for doing the heavy work in the trenches. When I was sent to France, we had a situation where we were building up to a million men but our camp was knee-deep in eternal mud and supply requisitions weren't working. So one afternoon I marched down to the docks with seven thousand men, confiscated fifty thousand sections of duckboards, which were wooden slats to be used in trenches, plus some shovels and kettles that we needed, and we carried them back to camp. Since I too carried a duckboard up the hill, I became known as General Duckboard. Hell, I've been called worse names than that.

I've been called a devil-dog, the bad boy of the marines, maverick Marine, old gimlet eye I didn't much care for that and, by Teddy Roosevelt, the ideal American soldier. I liked that one.

Anyhow, years later, in 1932, when President Hoover and the Congress had denied these brave men their bonus, these same wonderful men I had served with in France, and twenty thousand of them gathered in Washington, I urged them to stick it out. You've heard of the bonus marchers? I got up on this rickety stand they had built and said: "You hear folks call you fellows tramps, but they didn't call you that in '17 and '18. I never saw such fine soldiers. I never saw such discipline . . . You have as much right to lobby here as the United States Steel Corporation." If I were around today I'd be up on that stand again, believe me. Then General MacArthur came through and cleaned 'em out. I have no comment on that.

Q: There has been a lot of evidence of corporate profiteering on this current war, extending to the highest levels. What's you view?

General Butler: War is a racket. It always has been. It is possibly the oldest, easily the most profitable, surely the most vicious. It is the only one in which the profits are reckoned in dollars and the losses in lives. A racket is best described, I believe, as something that is not what it seems to the majority of people. Only a small "inside" group knows what it is about. It is conducted for the benefit of the very few, at the expense of the very many. Out of the war a few people make huge fortunes. New millionaires and billionaires are created in a war. How many of these war millionaires shouldered a rifle? How many of them dug a trench? How many of them were wounded or killed in battle? Out of war, nations acquire additional territory. They just take it. This newly acquired territory is exploited by the few the self-same few who wrung dollars out of blood in the war. The general public shoulders the bill. And what is this bill? This bill renders a horrible accounting. Newly placed gravestones. Mangled bodies. Shattered minds. Broken hearts and homes. Economic instability. Depression and all its attendant miseries. Back-breaking taxation for generations and generations. Truly, war is a racket.

Q: What do you suggest Americans do to stop this war?

General Butler: The Government declares war. To say helplessly: As individuals we have nothing to do with it, can't prevent it. But who are we? Well, "we" right now are the mothers and fathers of every able-bodied boy of military age in the United States. "We" are also you young men of voting age and over, that they'll use for cannon fodder. And "we" can prevent it. Now you mothers, particularly. The only way you can resist all this war hysteria and beating tomtoms is by hanging onto the love you bear your boys. When you listen to some well-worded, well-delivered speech, just remember that it's nothing but sound. It's your boy that matters. And no amount of sound can make up to you for the loss of your boy. After you've heard one of those speeches and your blood's all hot and you want to bite somebody like Hitler go upstairs to where your boy's asleep. . . . Look at him. Put your hand on that spot on the back of his neck. The place you used to love to kiss when he was a baby. Just rub it a little. You won't wake him up, he knows it's just you. Just look at his strong, fine young body because only the best boys are chosen for war. Look at this splendid young creature who's part of yourself, then close your eyes for a moment and I'll tell you what can happen . . .

Somewhere five thousand miles from home. Night. Darkness. Cold. A drizzling rain. The noise is terrific. All Hell has broken loose. A star shell burst in the air. Its unearthly flare lights up the muddy field. There's a lot of tangled rusty barbed wires out there and a boy hanging over them his stomach ripped out, and he's feebly calling for help and water. His lips are white and drawn. He's in agony.

There's your boy. The same boy who's lying in bed tonight. The same boy who trusts you. . . . Are you going to run out on him? Are you going to let someone beat a drum or blow a bugle and make him chase after it? Thank God, this is a democracy and by your voice and your vote you can save your boy. (from a 1939 broadcast)

Q: Finally, general, how do we end this war racket?

General Butler: Well, it's a racket all right. A few profit, and the many pay. But there is a way to stop it. You can't end it by disarmament conferences, peace parlays in Geneva or well-meaning resolutions. It can be smashed effectively only by taking the profit out of war.

First, before the government can recruit or conscript young people for military service, they must conscript politicians and industry and labor. Pay them the same that the soldiers get. They aren't running any risk of being killed or having their bodies mangled or their minds shattered, so why shouldn't they?

Second, hold a limited plebiscite to determine whether war should be declared, not of all the voters, but merely those who would be called upon to do the fighting. Why have the old president of a munitions firm or the flat-footed head of a tank plant vote on a venture of high profit and no risk to them?

A third step in this business of smashing the war racket is to make certain that our military forces are truly forces for defense only. At each session of Congress the question of naval appropriations comes up. The swivel-chair admirals in Washington are very adroit lobbyists. And they are smart. They don't shout: "We need a lot of battleships to war on this nation or that nation." Oh no. First they say that our nation is menaced by a great naval power, poised to strike suddenly and annihilate our people. Next they cry for a larger navy, for defense purposes only, of course. Then, they announce maneuvers in the Pacific Ocean, and the Indian Ocean, and the Gulf of Arabia, and any other place that's blue on the globe. The countries that border on these waters will be pleased beyond expression to see these warships just off their shores, just as we would be pleased as punch to see, through the morning mist, Chinese warships playing at war games off Los Angeles. I have proposed a constitutional amendment to limit our military forces to home defense purposes only. Let's pass all our suggested antiwar legislation, let's attend all the peace and disarmament conferences, let's have all the war protest meetings we can arrange, but if we really want to make war impossible, then let us by all means insist upon adding a Peace Amendment, such as the one which I have drafted, to the United States Constitution. That's how we can smash the war racket.

(end of interview)

Comment: Nobody ever claimed that they didn't understand General Butler, but a lot of people didn't like to be spoken to as plainly and as clearly as he spoke. One said: "If he was as wise in speech as he was brave in war, he would not have lost the prestige he deserved." Smedley Butler with lost prestige? Not on our watch. Be sure to read General Butler's book War Is a Racket, and please do whatever you can do to keep General Butler alive.

May 9, 2008

Don Bacon is a retired army officer who founded the Smedley Butler Society several years ago because, as General Butler said, "war is a racket."

Forum: Open Discussions

Bird Watching!

Gy7ras — Sun, 20 Apr 2008 20:32:30 GMT

An old man and women were walking in the park just enjoying a nice Spring day. Suddenly a bird flew overhead and crapped on the old man.

The old man yelled out, look what the bird did to my jacket to which his wife replied I see it!

The old man yelled out to her "well get some toilet paper! The old women thought about for a minute and then responded, that bird is already a half mile away by now!

Forum: Sea Stories!

River Valley Young Marines!

Gy7ras — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:07:33 GMT

We've been running a Young Marine Boot camp Since January of course that was only three days, and we're finishing up our Last two days in February (21st and 25th).

We'll be graduating our new recruits on February 25th. It's been busy working with 19 new recruits. We are scheduled to have our next boot camp in April of 2008. It seems that we have 40 new recruits waiting in the wings for that.

As the Training Officer and Drill Instructor I've stayed pretty busy. All our staff have worked hard to get the company formed as we all have different areas to work on.

Our CO. Mike Altrogge and his Adjutant Kathie Altrogge and our XO Johnny Gothard have worked very hard to to build this company of the River Valley Young Marines located in Fort Smith Arkansas.

We are of course part of the River Valley Detachment Marine Corps League. It's been a real experience working with fellow Marines again and helping to train Young Marines in the positive aspects of leadership and a drug free life style. Others areas of training are community service and citizenship.

I'm looking forward to April and the new batch of Young Marine Recruits coming our way.

Semper FI!

Gy7ras

Forum: Marine Corps League

Actively recruiting

SgtMic — Tue, 12 Feb 2008 18:47:02 GMT

current and prior Marines. We are looking to boost our members that are interested in competitive and just for fun gaming.

We are deep into America's Army and looking to branch into Call of Duty 4. Can't do it without you Marines.

If you are interested: www.usmc-warriors.org

Mods, if you need to move this, please do so.

Forum: Open Discussions

New Dog on the Block...

LarSim — Sun, 10 Feb 2008 19:28:38 GMT

A biuddy of mine from the Marine Corps Engineer's Association sent me this:

:D

- LarSim :cool:

Forum: Open Discussions

PLT 2048 SD 1973

smitty55 — Thur, 31 Jan 2008 22:15:18 GMT

I'm posting this as a message in a bottle.
PLT 2048 SD Graduated 1 Aug 1973. Our S.DI Gy Miller, J.DI's Sgt's Clark and Young.
After 35 years I have only ran across one other Marine that was in Boot Camp with me, he is the same.
The two that have been reconnected are me (Smith, M.G. and Watson James). I hope you find this, if you are looking for others that served with us.
Semper FI
Hap

Forum: Boot Camp Platoons

Newbie Air Winger.

kafj — Fri, 18 Jan 2008 14:32:51 GMT

I would like to say hello to all of you gyrenes who swung with the wing. My MOS 6123 ADJ (All Day Janitor). I'm just kidding. LOL My unit was 3rd MAW Headquarters and Maintenance Squadron-16 Power Plants shop. I worked on the GE-Turbon(jet)64 engine. My home squadron was Heavy Marine Helicopter-363 "Lucky Red Jelly Fish" I mean "Lucky Red Lions." We were based out of LTA Santa Ana as my elders would refer to Marine Corps Air Station Tustin, CA. I was a Hollywood Marine MCRD San Diego, CA June through September '83 Plt 3077 Blue T-shirts. I spent two deployments in Okinawknawk MCAS Futenma, Okinawa Japan. I volunteered for a TDY to Team Spirit '86. I would like to say a few words of encouragement to my fellow Marines over in Iraq and Afghanistan "Here's to you may you never have to find out if a CH-53E "Super Sea Stallion" can auto rotate. Keep your heads low and believe in the guy next to you because they will always have your back! And when you return to the land of the big PX I'll be there to shake your hand and buy you a round! OohRaah Marine!!!! At ease!!!! Gods Speed and Carry On!!!!

Forum: Marine Corps Air!

My Kids 21st Birthday is coming up the 27th of this Month

RonMann — Wed, 16 Jan 2008 21:12:29 GMT

So after he got back from the sand box, we went looking for what type side arm that he would like.

So this past week end I went and picked one up for him.

H&K USP .45 ACP in OD Green

Used, around 200 rounds fired thru it.

The Misses and I are driving down to Jacksonville this week end to give it to him.

Forum: The Weapons Locker!

Phyrog Story

RonMann — Wed, 16 Jan 2008 14:10:47 GMT

I was a Phyrog Crew Chief back in the late late '70's with the majority of my time being on CH-46F models with HMM-264 Black Knights. In February of '79 I was transferred to HMM-162 which at that time was the 1st and only operational E model squadron in the Fleet.

I know that the majority of Active Duty Marines in the Fleet has only crewed and worked on the E Model but in its day view it was a God Send to those of us who had been on F and D models. The main advantages were the "New Composite Blades", the 1500 SHP engines, and finally the external hoist. All these things that maybe taken for granted today, but they made our lives a whole lot easier, both in the air and on the ground.

Of all these changes that were made, the most significant one was the engines. When we went from 1000 shaft horse power to 1500 shaft, they put some real backbone in the ole Phyrogs lifting power. I was one of the 1st crew chiefs to really see what the Ole Gal could really do.

From what I understand the Marine Corps doesn't use the M1A1 105MM Howitzer operationally in its Artillery Bat. anymore, everything has gone over to the 155MM. Back in the 70's the main piece for the Marines was the 105MM which weight was at 4980 pounds, which were with in the lifting capabilities of the E-Models. Earlier, lifting this weapon had only been in the realm of the CH-53D, none of the earlier models of Phyrogs could even come close to doing the deed.

On the afternoon of the 23rd of May, 1979, I got to be the first 46 crew chief to be able to external a 105. We flew over to main side to lift a battery of 3 guns and transport them across the New River to another LZ.
As we were hovering over the weapon it seemed to me that the sling was attached differently to the gun than what I had seen in the past. When I had seen 53's pick up 105's the sling had always been attached to the trails and the barrel of the weapon system, this time I noticed that the sling was attached to the Axles of the carriage and to the trails. This being my first lift of this package, I thought the ground crew knew what they were doing. We made the lift with no problems but as we gained forward airspeed the gun began to teeter on it axles with slack in the cargo straps going back to the trails. When we got to around 60 to 70 knots the gun completely flipped in its sling upside down, with trails of the gun missing the bird by mere inches. Talk about bouncing a bird. The HAC said my voice went up about 6 octaves when I relayed what had just happened. We proceed to the intended destination and delivered the gun inverted. The HAC communicated to the Battery CO that he needed to find out what was wrong with the rigging on the gun. We then proceeded back to pick up another 105. As we were hovering over the 2nd package, I informed the HAC that this package was rigged the same as the 1st one. His reply was "Watch it." The same thing happened. This as we approached 50 knots the trails tried to flip again, but this time I 'Pickled the Ole Girl". I can still hear those engines and blades when I released that load to this day. I watched the load all the way down, barrel first. It hit a 70 foot NC Yellow Pine and the wheels on the carriage went flying in different directions. It was Hoot to watch.

After all this was said and done, it was found out that this was an "experiment " in transporting the 105. However, when the weapon was to be rigged by the axles, the barrel was to place out of battery. In other words the barrel was to be in the rear position so that center of mass would be between the axle and the trails. As it was, the center mass was over the axle and the trails acted as a giant airfoil. That same day the Navy up at Little River had a 53 lifting a 105 in the same configuration and they weren't as lucky. They had an impact with the trails and a large amount of damage was done to the belly of the airframes. We were all lucky and grateful that worst didn't happen.

So what is the moral of this story? If it doesn't look right, then most likely it isn't. Don't be shy in questioning a load even if you have never carried it before and don't be shy in getting rid of a load when it becomes unsafe, you might not have a second chance like I did, Bros.

Forum: War Stories

My Weapons

jamgusmc — Tue, 15 Jan 2008 22:16:17 GMT

I have the following:

AR15 - 1 I built the other is waiting on being built.
12Guage - had since I was 17
Rem. 7400, 30.06 - bought
Ruger 10/22 - bought
Ruger P22 - bought
G23 - bought
Moisin Nagant - given to me
AK47 - Given to me, still not put together

If I were a rich man I would have soooo much more!!! SOMEDAY *dreaming*

Forum: The Weapons Locker!

Paris Island Feb-May 1989

jamgusmc — Tue, 15 Jan 2008 22:02:47 GMT

Plt 1034 series 1032

Forum: Boot Camp Platoons

Happy Birthday, Gunny.

SgtBach — Tue, 08 Jan 2008 22:20:19 GMT

Hope you had a great Birthday, Gunny.

Forum: Open Discussions

WHY DOES THE GOVERNMENT FEAR ARMED VETERANS?

CplBobGomez — Fri, 04 Jan 2008 23:09:19 GMT

WHY DOES THE GOVERNMENT FEAR ARMED VETERANS?

http://www.newswithviews.com/Stang/alan24.htm

Please open the link and read Alan Stang's essay. He poses some interesting questions that should concern all of us who have served.

Regards,

Bob

Forum: Sound Off!

So How dose It Look!

Gy7ras — Fri, 04 Jan 2008 17:42:46 GMT

OK!

Iowa is over and it's early yet, so what dose it look like for the next president! Will we have our first historic black president, or will it be the Baptist preacher from Arkansas, or still maybe Hillary???

Forum: Sound Off!

Marine Corps History This Date!

Gy7ras — Fri, 04 Jan 2008 17:35:40 GMT

1928 - Marines participated in the Battle of Quilali during the occupation of Nicaragua.

1991 - Marines Evacuated 260 U.S. and foreign citizens from the American Embassy, Mogadishu, Somalia during Operation Eastern Exit.

Forum: Marine Corps History